Last year, Warner Brothers invited a group of journalists to the London set ofFantastic Beasts 2: The Crimes of Grindelwald. Production was just getting off the ground, but we were able to see some truly spectacular sets (more on that in a bit). We were also fortunate enough to speak with some of the mega-talent behind the series, including producerDavid Heyman, directorDavid Yates, costume designer and living legendColleen Atwood, supervising art directorMartin Foley, as well as starsEddie Redmayne,Ezra Miller, andCallum Turner(a new face to the franchise who plays Newt’s older brother Theseus). They all gave us really interesting perspectives on the sequel, its connections to Harry Potter, and what they learned from the first movie. And whatever they couldn’t reveal specifically they made up for in charm.
Below, Miller talks about Credence joining the Circus Arcanum, how much he loves all of the costuming, Credence’s wounds and how he has never been able to love or trust anyone before, the creativity on set, and why it’s allllll sicky nar nar:
QUESTION: So can you talk a little bit about Credence’s journey? It seems like he’s much freer now in this movie, so where is headed?
EZRA MILLER: Well, I would say that he is both free and burdened in new ways. Obviously, there is an element of self-awareness that brings both of those factors into play. So he’s free of a lot of the confines he’s known, and he’s free of a sense of uncertainty that he’s known. But with the consciousness of his reality comes also heavy burdens, and obviously, he’s a bit of a ticking time bomb, given his particular magical condition. And there is a burden that comes in the form of a burning need to know more about who he actually is and to understand the roots that he’s growing from. Because obviously he’s had a very fragmented experience up to this point. So this quest for identity, which I can’t relate to at all. No one knows what that’s like to try and figure out who you are! It’s obscure, you know.
With a journey like his, are you guys truly on just a film-by-film basis, where you only know what you need to know for this film?
MILLER:Sometimes we’re given glimpses into the crystal ball by, you know, the metaphorical Professor Trelawny. We do get a little bit of divination going. Sometimes to give a sense … some people are playing out longer arcs. But there’s definitely a lot that we do not know. There’s a lot that no one knows except for J.K. Rowling. You know what I mean? At all times it, it’s amazing. It creates actually a really dynamic experience of, I think, of making a series of movies. I find it really engaging, and I think everyone’s sort of along for the ride, anxious to know more about the story that we’re all telling together.
These wounds we see, are they from the first movie, or are they more that have been picked up into the second movie?
MILLER: I mean there’s been a lot of wounding for Credence. There’s a lot of sources of the wounds obviously. He’s been through a lot. He’s been through the mill this one.
We saw some of the art for the circus. So can you tell us a little bit about Credence and the circus and sort of what happens with that?
MILLER:Yes, The Circus Arcanus. It’s really interesting. I mean obviously, the histories of side shows are disturbing ones. This era … that world would have been a world of a lot of heavy exploitation. Definitely some animal cruelty. At the very least, PETA would have been displeased. And it’s interesting because we heard in Credence’s narrative in the first film, the derogatory term “freak” thrown at him in a way that was deeply effective, right? And I find it really interesting that we find him here in a sideshow, in a freak show as they were known. I mean obviously, it’s fascinating to be a part of this exploration of what that world looked like, but in the magical context – because obviously also for all of its exploitative practices – it’s a place where some people with strange abilities and incredible talents were sort of being glimpsed by the real Muggle world, you know? It’s obviously a beautiful set and an incredible … well, you know, incredible things. Magic circus, I mean … I don’t have to sell you on that!
In the first movie, there was a weird connection between Grindelwald and Credence, I was wondering was the idea to portray an abusive relationship? Or not? Will we see more of this explored in the sequel?
MILLER:I definitely felt personally that a lot of the exploration with Credence revolved around the idea of abuse and some of the different ways that trauma can happen to a young person. I personally see that in a lot of the exploration of Credence. [There’s] something interesting about this idea of light and dark magic, and it’s said many times in this series that love is a form of light magic, right? And so Grindelwald’s manipulation of love, targeting that deficit that he could perceive in Credence, is a form of abuse. You could also say it’s a form of dark magic, to wield power over that human need.
Credence seems to be finding his place in the wizard world after a world where lived with Muggles who attempted to like stamp the wizard out of him, which are things that are very parallel to Harry Potter. Did you find any inspiration from his character when you were like developing your role in the new film?
MILLER: What I think is interesting in the story of Credence is that he has been betrayed and mistreated by both worlds at this point. He has been mistreated by folks in the wizarding world, and No-Mag or Muggle folks as well. And so I think there a great skepticism of everyone he sees. I find in Credence this feeling that if he’s ever going to look someone in the eye, it’s going to be to analyze and question their intent and their integrity, because he’s just been given no basis to perceive trustworthiness or compassion in another person. And so I find that to be an important part of the exploration. I think he has very little knowledge of any of the Dumbledore folks at this point. I mean, there was a wizard alluded to, who Grindelwald was obviously portraying as a sinister figure to him, and I think that is the extent of his knowledge.
I think something’s that’s going to be on a lot people’s mind is the hair. What’s happening with the hair?
MILLER:Sure. Yeah.
Is it coming back? Is it going out? I mean what are you hoping? Because people want to know.
MILLER:I think that is probably the hook that’ll bring people back to those seats. So I really wouldn’t want to leak any crucial information about … I mean it could be, right? I mean you can only see edges. This is the perfect time to do this. I mean there could be a new Credence hairdos.
We were told that Credence becomes friends with people or creatures in the circus. Is there anything you can tell us about those relationships?
MILLER:Yeah, I wouldn’t want to share anything like … when you’re in a traveling circus, “it’s complicated” is pretty much the relationship status across the board, you know?
Can you talk about Credence’s new look aside from the hair? You’ve got some more color going on, a bit of tweed.
MILLER:Oh, look, I’m pretty grateful to slip into any given garment that can be found around this entire set. I mean, it’s hard to keep me in the clothes I’ve been assigned. Obviously Colleen Atwood is a supreme master, [it’s] really fun to work with her.
You mentioned that Credence has difficultly trusting people, but with Tina there was a sort of a bonding relationship that sort of expands on, and Tina actually goes and looks for him. Can you expand a bit about that?
MILLER:Yeah, I mean certainly we’ve seen sort of only fragments of a story in which Tina did care for Credence, and that was a rare and noted instance in Credence’s story. But again, when you really think about it, what does Credence actually know about that human being, where she comes from? I mean, the last interaction was a deeply confusing one where there were a lot of things going on on the subway tracks, you know? So yeah, I think that’s one of the connections. And different characters throughout this narrative – which is really what I find so great about this film we’re working on now, is this expansion, this further expansion of the world – many of the characters have inherent velocity towards one another for one reason or another. Everyone has a really strong drive when you look at the characters in this story, both the ones we’re following from the last film, and new ones who play crucial roles in the lives of those characters we met in the first one. And that I always find to be a fascinating dynamic, particularly in a series when there is a core group of characters we really care about who then are on journeys. We have a sense, or we have a question, of whether or not they will lead back to one another. I think that stuff is cool.
Would you like to see Credence with a romantic storyline? Because I feel it’s like a normal phase of growing up, and Credence was deprived of so much of a normal youth.
MILLER:I wouldn’t want to like speculate specifically, or I don’t really hope for … I’m so grateful to be along for whatever the ride is. I don’t really have any hopes or demands for the trajectory of the character. I trust the writer. But I am really interested in all sorts of directions that could be possible in Credence’s exploration, because I think there is a seed of common truth to the story of Credence, that is really interesting to apply to all different sorts of relationships or rights of passage in life. Because obviously for anyone who’s had that sort of history, there would be a continued history of working it out and working through it …
You emphasized that this movie will feature more character dynamics and more action with those characters. Are there any pieces that you’re excited to play around with for your character?
MILLER:Yeah, I mean you guys are looking at the construction of one. You saw the actual circus going up? Yeah, I’m excited about a bunch of set pieces. Which ones can we talk about? One of them I missed was, I know I can talk about this because no one could keep this one in the bag, is Hogwarts. There’s some Hogwarts, which, spoiler alert: I’m not in. It’s fine. No it’s fine. I thought I would attempt to sneak on, you know, sneak into the back of a class. Um, it’s very hard. They have a lot of protections. Why are you doing this? You’re just pouring lemon on an open wound! You know, that Himalayan salt? You’re grinding it in a deep wound right now!
Didn’t you at least get to go on the sets? Did you at least have a look around?
MILLER:Honestly, I thought it was great. I had a couple weeks off to do some other work. I was in the United States and around different parts of Europe, and I came back and I was asking what they’d been up to, and how it’d been. And they said, oh, it’s been pretty much the same except for we did have that week where we were in Hogwarts. And I was like so deeply devastated, trying to cover it up, play it cool. I was like, oh, that’s – that’s fine. What chocolate frog are you talking about? Nobody called me. Nobody even thought to send a text.
So we’ve heard that the actors get a little bit of ownership over their characters, where if you have ideas for things, that might make it in. So besides requesting to be at Hogwarts, is there anything in the first movie or this one that you sort of added in, or asked like “I sort of see Credence maybe doing this?”
MILLER: Honestly, no. Again, I’m–
Just happy to be here.
MILLER:Yeah, what’s really great and what I find really wonderful is the way that this environment facilitates expression, it’s really special. It’s a very particular feeling on this set. It’s immense. It’s also more quieter than a lot of smaller sets I’ve ever been on. There’s a real sense of collaboration in the process of finding each scene. We take time to rehearse, which is a rare gift when you’re on a studio schedule making an enormous movie. We have a lot of really considered conversations in which everyone’s voice is heard who’s participating in the scene. We work really intimately with these various devoted departments, like the puppeteers and the visual effects department, the props department, you know, various people who are enabling us to fall deeper and deeper into a world of imagination, and so that is a delight. I haven’t had any specific requests for things to happen in the story. I’m very, very, very pleased with all of the material. I find a lot of depth and meaning in it. I still do. I still relate and connect to it as directly as I did when I was first interacting with the material as a young person, and to be able to ride that wave through this creative experience is … sicky nar nar, bros!
There’s our headline right there.
MILLER: Yeah, “actor says experience in movie is quote/unquote sicky nar nar my broskies."
Was keeping the Johnny Depp secret one of the toughest things?
MILLER:Oh, no, now, see this is great. What’s great is when I don’t have to keep it secret because I genuinely don’t know. We were doing a shot – I mean right before it, it became common knowledge – we were doing a shoot that happened after production on the first one, it was like some additional photography which was around the time when he was doing his work. And I did not know who it was until I was literally shaking his hand.
MILLER: People were just calling him Johnny and yeah. So no, it was very easy to keep – that’s the easiest type of secret to keep.
They certainly keep a lot of secrets from you.
MILLER:It’s as I said, it’s very exciting. It’s very exciting. You just never know what’s coming, for sure. But again, just along for the ride, cowabunga sicky nar nar bros.
